Comments on: Fire trucks: big, shiny, and red http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/the-lafd-needs-more-trucks/ Griffith Park & Silver Lake Blog. Tue, 17 Apr 2012 17:18:59 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Donna Barstow http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/the-lafd-needs-more-trucks/comment-page-1/#comment-18752 Donna Barstow Mon, 13 Dec 2010 00:23:24 +0000 http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/in-which-i-make-a-phone-call-and-connect-with-one-of-my-commenters/#comment-18752 Admin is here, and up on the about me tab, and on every single post here. Admin is here, and up on the about me tab, and on every single post here.

]]> By: Donna http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/the-lafd-needs-more-trucks/comment-page-1/#comment-37 Donna Sun, 15 Jul 2007 21:30:41 +0000 http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/in-which-i-make-a-phone-call-and-connect-with-one-of-my-commenters/#comment-37 <p>Jason, thanks for all the inside info!</p> <p>I can't ask the right questions without a direction to go in, so thanks!</p> <p>You brought up some interesting points, including the fact that maybe we don't have forest-fire type areas inside the city. It was also good info that firefighters in LA are skilled in multiple areas, not just one. But I have to agree mostly with this: "it would be nice to have more brush-specific apparatus in L.A.."</p> <p>And don't forget one of your earlier comments, which gives me hope for the future: "I'm sure there were things the LAFD could have done better. But one thing I've learned from being in Los Angeles - the LAFD doesn't let problems occur twice. They'll learn from the GP fire."</p> Jason, thanks for all the inside info!

I can’t ask the right questions without a direction to go in, so thanks!

You brought up some interesting points, including the fact that maybe we don’t have forest-fire type areas inside the city. It was also good info that firefighters in LA are skilled in multiple areas, not just one. But I have to agree mostly with this: “it would be nice to have more brush-specific apparatus in L.A..”

And don’t forget one of your earlier comments, which gives me hope for the future: “I’m sure there were things the LAFD could have done better. But one thing I’ve learned from being in Los Angeles – the LAFD doesn’t let problems occur twice. They’ll learn from the GP fire.”

]]> By: Jason Randall http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/the-lafd-needs-more-trucks/comment-page-1/#comment-36 Jason Randall Sun, 15 Jul 2007 02:38:13 +0000 http://donnabarstow.com/park_blog/2007/07/06/in-which-i-make-a-phone-call-and-connect-with-one-of-my-commenters/#comment-36 Donna, it's refreshing to see that you're interested in the reactions of others when you create a post, and more to the point, to the facts that relate to your post. Good for you. With regard to firefighting apparatus within the City of Los Angeles, it's important to note that L.A. is one of the most unique environments any fire service organization could imagine. There are multiple airports, the largest container harbor (and growing passenger ship use, too), high-rise buildings, congested urban and high-end residential neighborhoods, not to mention brush-filled canyons and industrial buildings. No matter how you look at it, the complexity is daunting. The LAFD operates a bit differently from many other fire departments. In many communities, firefighters have a specialty - they might be truckies (ladder company), engine firefighters, or medics. In L.A. firefighters rotate among all types of apparatus. Because of that, each firefighter is capable at multiple tasks. When you consider that there are, on average, only 1,000 firefighters on duty at any time (to protect more than 4 million people), it's a vital and value-proven strategy. As for apparatus, a similar style of fireground management is used. In L.A. fire companies are broken into several types. There is a basic engine company (one fire engine, typically a triple combination [hose, water, pump]). There is a task force (truck company, engine company, 2nd engine [referred to as the pump, although it's usually a triple]). In a task force station, the engine often operates individually, while the pump and the truck operate together as a "lite force." There's an important method to the madness: A light force can be first in at a structure fire and the commander can assign his firefighters to ventilation, fire attack and rescue. Because the firefighters rotate their "jobs" the commander can make any adjustment to fulfill the assignment for the best safety and protection of lives and property. As it relates to brush, the city is actually very well prepared. In addition to the resources of 104 fire stations, there are four brush patrols, six helicopters, and a very well equipped tractor team. If you're interested in learning more, you might want to visit Fire Station 88 in the San Fernando Valley. As an aside, the city also has five fire boats, including the largest fireboat in the U.S. (Fireboat 2). Firefighting isn't just about apparatus. It's about several critical things: incident command, proper tools, and proper relationships with other agencies. There are relatively few brush fires in L.A. city. The areas of brush that are contained within the city are unlike forest areas - or Ventura County for that matter. Specialized brush apparatus would be ill-used at a structure fire and as such, don't offer the city the versatility that is required in L.A. Brush fires in L.A. require the rapid deployment of city resources, the cooperation of state and city agencies close to L.A. and a unified command system to protect the lives of firefighters battling the blaze, as well as to effectively combat and destroy the threat. In the case of Griffith Park, I personally saw brush-equipped CDF teams on scene within two hours of the initial response. There were apparatus and teams from Beverly Hills, Glendale, Pasadena, and of course, the county of Los Angeles. The ICP (incident command post) at the Greek Theater was in place nearly immediately and fire officers were quickly looking at the overall parameters of the fire and how to both put it out and protect property and lives. So, while it would be nice to have more brush-specific apparatus in L.A., it really doesn't make a lot of sense to do so. The apparatus in the city that is used is versatile, modern, and durable. By the way, our fire department equipment is all labeled with CLASS 1 on the side of the rigs. The National Insurance Underwriters used this ranking system (recently discontinued) to highlight those departments that kept losses below a certain dollar figure per acre. L.A. has nearly always been near the top of all fire agencies in the U.S. And, please don't give the commanders here short shrift either. While there are certainly politics to be aware of, nearly all LAFD officers spend countless hours training, teaching, practicing and working to improve all tactics and strategies related to their profession. What you might want to investigate are the real dangers related to brush fires here: narrow streets that are blocked by cars, dumpsters, and other obstacles; brush clearance violations, and a general lack of preparedness by homeowners in high risk areas. Oh, and as it relates to this issue, note that the city of L.A. will conduct a homeowner evacuation drill in Hollywood (near the GP), on 28 July. Local homeowner associations have the details, as does the LAFD. Donna, it’s refreshing to see that you’re interested in the reactions of others when you create a post, and more to the point, to the facts that relate to your post. Good for you.
With regard to firefighting apparatus within the City of Los Angeles, it’s important to note that L.A. is one of the most unique environments any fire service organization could imagine. There are multiple airports, the largest container harbor (and growing passenger ship use, too), high-rise buildings, congested urban and high-end residential neighborhoods, not to mention brush-filled canyons and industrial buildings. No matter how you look at it, the complexity is daunting.
The LAFD operates a bit differently from many other fire departments. In many communities, firefighters have a specialty – they might be truckies (ladder company), engine firefighters, or medics. In L.A. firefighters rotate among all types of apparatus. Because of that, each firefighter is capable at multiple tasks. When you consider that there are, on average, only 1,000 firefighters on duty at any time (to protect more than 4 million people), it’s a vital and value-proven strategy.
As for apparatus, a similar style of fireground management is used. In L.A. fire companies are broken into several types. There is a basic engine company (one fire engine, typically a triple combination [hose, water, pump]). There is a task force (truck company, engine company, 2nd engine [referred to as the pump, although it's usually a triple]). In a task force station, the engine often operates individually, while the pump and the truck operate together as a “lite force.”
There’s an important method to the madness: A light force can be first in at a structure fire and the commander can assign his firefighters to ventilation, fire attack and rescue. Because the firefighters rotate their “jobs” the commander can make any adjustment to fulfill the assignment for the best safety and protection of lives and property.
As it relates to brush, the city is actually very well prepared. In addition to the resources of 104 fire stations, there are four brush patrols, six helicopters, and a very well equipped tractor team. If you’re interested in learning more, you might want to visit Fire Station 88 in the San Fernando Valley. As an aside, the city also has five fire boats, including the largest fireboat in the U.S. (Fireboat 2).
Firefighting isn’t just about apparatus. It’s about several critical things: incident command, proper tools, and proper relationships with other agencies. There are relatively few brush fires in L.A. city. The areas of brush that are contained within the city are unlike forest areas – or Ventura County for that matter. Specialized brush apparatus would be ill-used at a structure fire and as such, don’t offer the city the versatility that is required in L.A.
Brush fires in L.A. require the rapid deployment of city resources, the cooperation of state and city agencies close to L.A. and a unified command system to protect the lives of firefighters battling the blaze, as well as to effectively combat and destroy the threat.
In the case of Griffith Park, I personally saw brush-equipped CDF teams on scene within two hours of the initial response. There were apparatus and teams from Beverly Hills, Glendale, Pasadena, and of course, the county of Los Angeles. The ICP (incident command post) at the Greek Theater was in place nearly immediately and fire officers were quickly looking at the overall parameters of the fire and how to both put it out and protect property and lives.
So, while it would be nice to have more brush-specific apparatus in L.A., it really doesn’t make a lot of sense to do so. The apparatus in the city that is used is versatile, modern, and durable. By the way, our fire department equipment is all labeled with CLASS 1 on the side of the rigs. The National Insurance Underwriters used this ranking system (recently discontinued) to highlight those departments that kept losses below a certain dollar figure per acre. L.A. has nearly always been near the top of all fire agencies in the U.S.
And, please don’t give the commanders here short shrift either. While there are certainly politics to be aware of, nearly all LAFD officers spend countless hours training, teaching, practicing and working to improve all tactics and strategies related to their profession.
What you might want to investigate are the real dangers related to brush fires here: narrow streets that are blocked by cars, dumpsters, and other obstacles; brush clearance violations, and a general lack of preparedness by homeowners in high risk areas. Oh, and as it relates to this issue, note that the city of L.A. will conduct a homeowner evacuation drill in Hollywood (near the GP), on 28 July. Local homeowner associations have the details, as does the LAFD.

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